The Chode Quandary

Posted in General on 01/18/2010 05:44 am by DJ Fuji

There’s something I’ve seen recently that I want to bring up because it’s a super common sticking point that has recently regained popularity. It’s this whole “chode” thing. I remember how damaging it was back in the day to a lot of guys, only back then we called it something else. This ‘new’ version isn’t any different. I guess it really shows you how cyclical things are in pickup.

Back in 2004-2005 (when I had to walk to school in the freezing snow… uphill… both ways…), we came across a strange phenomenon in the community. Guys who were coming from so-called “AFC” backgrounds were becoming obsessed with proving that they were no longer human doormats. They had grown so tired of the feeling of powerlessness that they had made it their personal quest to become exactly the opposite. Now when a woman asked them to buy them a drink at the bar, these men were armed with an arsenal of witty comeback lines. When a women tried to shit test them or control frame, they were prepared with re-frames. And when an old lady fell down the stairs, they walked right by her, showing how “unreactive” they could be. You know, to show her how “alpha” they were.

Wait… What?

It’s embarrassing in hindsight. We were trying so hard to be “Anti-AFC” and were so adamant about our quest to “kill the AFC inside of us,” that we began to kill off any compassion, human decency, or perhaps most importantly, genuine love for women.

Guys who fell in love with a woman they had met refused to consider a relationship with them because, well, “that was AFC.”

Guys who cared a lot about women pretended to be assholes because, “they didn’t want to be AFC.”


 Make no mistake about it: Today’s “chode” is nothing more than yesterday’s “AFC.”

And guys who were otherwise decent, compassionate people were suddenly on a strange jerk-kool-aid-binge to see who could be the biggest douchebag in the shortest amount of time.

We didn’t realize that the course we were taking was bringing us to the opposite side of the spectrum. And the opposite is just as unhealthy.

I remember a few times when I was hanging out with a good friend of mine and his sister needed help with something. The “normal” me would have helped her because that’s just my personality. I like helping people. That’s precisely why I have this job. But at the time, the new-and-improved “alpha” version of me said that helping her would be ‘supplicating’ and therefore I shouldn’t do it.

So I didn’t.

And later, when we were at the bar with friends and she got sick and decided to go home, no one (me included) walked her home because we were all trying to be ‘alpha’ and not show that we were decent human beings.

Fortunately, about 10 minutes after she left, I came to my senses and realized how stupid this was. I ran after her to make sure she got home ok.

I found her passed out on the ground outside.

That was my wakeup call.

It was someone slapping me in the face with my own (perhaps lack of) humanity and absurdity. I wanted to become this ‘alpha pickup artist’ so badly that I was abandoning the things I believed in—the things that made me “me.”

Don’t worry, I’m not going to go off on a rant about being yourself. I’m obviously not against growth, personal change, or even personality improvement/overhauls. But this same ‘anti-AFC’ sentiment that I went through years ago is now rearing its ugly head again under the guise of the ‘anti-chode’ movement.

Make no mistake about it: Today’s “chode” is nothing more than yesterday’s “AFC.”

Don’t get sucked into the anti-chode hype. I’m seeing the exact same thing on forums and message boards all over the internet now.

“She said ‘I love you’ but I would never say it back to her because I’m not some supplicating chode.”

Start by removing the word “Chode” from your vocabulary. It serves no purpose other than to make you feel superior by painting others with a condescending, lesser-value label. In essence, it makes you collectively feel better about yourself by looking down on others.

And that, obviously, is not the way to go about building healthy beliefs and inner game.

We should be in this whole thing to better ourselves, and part of that means not being judgmental. It’s easy for us to look at ‘supplicative’ behavior with disdain. But it wasn’t that long ago that most of us were in that boat. Judging and looking down on others might make us feel better temporarily, but it is nothing more than a mental version of the bully who puts everyone else down so that he can feel better about himself. And as Cam Teone is now famous for quoting (via Rocky), “You’re better than that.”

 

24 Comments

  1. True dat.

    Most folks starting out do seem to take a concept and run with it. Unfortunately it takes longer to find the tipping point of ‘being alpha’ because, unlike a lot of other concepts in game, you can push it into assholedom and still get girls.

    I like to imagine that most guys eventually find the limit and then pull back to a healthy place where they can separate compassion from supplication, but maybe I have too optimistic a view of humanity.

    Great post, keep up the good work, bro.

  2. Surreal Deception
    01/18/2010 at 11:08

    Awesome post, it hits right on.
    Its misinterpretation.
    I’ve known about the community since almost 1.5 years, but personally haven’t experienced this, but I’ve personally experienced it with other, guys trying to be SuperHardcoreAlphaAlpha who found out about chode and afc, even some girls, it was hilarious, they would be hangin out with us and telling their boyfriends, ‘you think i’m fuckin chode?’ hahaha.
    I had a pivot who went over the top and called guys glazed donuts, afc’s, chode, everything. If a guy normally came up and talked to her she would till him ‘you’re an afc, and afc means average frustrated chump.. ‘ . Bullshit.
    Things like ‘you think im fuckin chode’ were commonplace.

    I like the thing you highlight, ‘trying’ to be ‘hardcore’ itself is the Afc/chode thing to do. Don’t overdo it.
    I mean recognizing behaviors is a good thing, but don’t do what DjFuji mentions here.
    Its just the MISINTERPRETATION of things. Communication is a complex thing you know.

    Just like so many people in the community badmouth SS and Disqualification, simply because they don’t understand it.

    Good post.
    Peace, 1 love.

  3. True. But I think we need to look deeper. Maybe on individual case basis why each PUA is acting “hyper-alpha”. Some of these guys have been that person passed out outside a bar while bitchy 9′s and 10′s walk by laughing.

    I think it’s good to flex your “alpha” mentality muscles. Most guys I’ve seen in two years come into calibration through an event like this. The pendulum swings back and forth a few times, from too nice to uber jerk. Then they eventually return to Earth.

  4. gr8 post DJ, I’ve noticed this about myself the past few months. Trying to remove the “Nice Guy” me into more Alpha me, but not being the normal/friendly guy in situations that call for it. It’s probably easy if one separates “Sarging” from the rest of day-2-day life, but for those, like myself, looking to incorporate ‘pua-ness’ into my normal every day being, it’s a tough pill to swallow. Over time it gets easier, like helping the woman last week with fire logs to her car. Alpha and nice at the same time. Still a work in progress…

  5. Great post, DJ. Wish I had read this a year ago; I was so busy being the “new and improved” alpha male that I didn’t see that I was slowly losing the woman that I truly loved and cared about. 15 months into the relationship, and she had enough. I didn’t give her the attention that she was asking for, and she went and found a “chode” who gave her the attention that she wanted.

    It’s one thing to be a PUA when going through the attraction and seduction phases; its another when you transition to a serious, loving relationship. Tough lesson learned.

  6. @All:

    I don’t see it as “being a PUA,” I see it as truly understanding this concept of “alpha.” Alpha means that you are confident, that you are a leader, and that you go after what you want in life. While that SOUNDS similar to “Be arrogant, demand that people follow you, and TAKE what you can get out of life,” they really aren’t the same thing at all. Confidence, for example, is much more about knowing you can do something than it is TRYING TO PROVE TO EVERYONE ELSE that you can do something. The very nature of trying to prove things to other people means that something isn’t right — that you’re not truly confident, it’s more like arrogance or boldness.

    Alpha and nice aren’t mutually exclusive. Alpha and DOORMAT are mutually exclusive. Alpha and “nice so that people like me” are mutually exclusive. Again, very, very big difference.

  7. “And when an old lady fell down the stairs, they walked right by her, showing how “unreactive” they could be.”

    Are you freakin’ serious!?!?!

    Who the HELL did this??!?!

    Just goes to show you that not all 2 legged animals are humans, or even Chimps.

    So what are PUA gurus doing to ensure that men don’t walk away from their bootcamps disrespecting people?

    American culture is already lowest common denominator. You might want to think twice before you put ideas, even seemingly harmless ones, into the minds of adults who grew up in a dysfunctional environment.

    Being that they are already so bottom of the barrell, many American men will interpret “confidence” as “assholery”.

    How could they not? We’re not dealing with fully functioning human beings here.

  8. @Desi:
    This issue is not limited to American men. I’ve seen this type of thing happen on multiple continents and multiple countries.

    I can’t speak for all the gurus out there, but in my boot camps I stress the importance of responsibility with power and balance in life. It’s part of the self development process.

  9. I think that this happens partly because part of learning means testing out extremes. The key to finding balance that one can be satisfied with is self-awareness. Realizing where living in that extreme has taken them and deciding whether or not that is really where they want to be.

    DJ, this awareness came to you when you went after your friend.

    I think that if we experiment reminding ourselves to stay very self-aware, it can be ok to make extreme, potentially bad, decisions but come out better in the long run.

    -Nicky

  10. @Nicky: Agree 100%. I will always sacrifice in the short term if it means progress in the long term.

  11. Lol … nice post :)

    The old lady down the stairs is hilarious, and yes, shows how ridiculous “unreactive” can become …

  12. I used to do fall into this trap sometime ago. Then I read some PU materials, both promoting either the extreme end of being nice and compassionate yet still being able to win attraction as well as the other end of being uber alpha and well.. winning attraction as well.

    Of course, it didn’t made sense to me, because they contradicted, so I sat down and spent some time, and I drew a common thread between the materials which also helped to solve my problem.

    For those trapped in this chode mode, a good rule of thumb of remaining alpha while retaining what makes you is this:

    Supplicate as much as you can, doing everything a traditional AFC would do, calling her, tending to her, validating her, but only and only because you want to and feel like it, and not because you want something in return.

    In other words, the way to go about this is to see supplication as value giving, without any strings attached. Do it because you are generous and really want to make her feel good, not because you want to get into her skirt. Take it as a sort of charity work. :)

  13. @Mysterial: I like it. Very true. Perhaps not always 100% tactically effective (some guys WANT to call her 10x a day right after meeting her), but no one can deny its authenticity.

  14. MunichHawk
    02/01/2010 at 03:07

    Great article,

    I think all the guys who spended a lot of time in the community (in my case over three years) been there.
    Nice people turn into real jackasses from one day to another.
    In my case as well as yours into big jackasses.
    If you look at naturals, the majority of them are actually really nice guys, they just don´t tolerate bullshit from others.

    One of the reasons its hard for me to hang out with so called pua´s the constant ongoing “alpha male battles” are so tiresome and so not alpha….

    I think getting this really separates guys into two fractions, the ones who really grow as a person and the guys who might get laid and became fantastic social manipulators but on the inside stay as unhappy as they were.

  15. Well put, DJ!

    I would go even further and say the whole mentality of “negging” and “demonstrating value” is along the same lines as “not being AFC”.

    Some guys still cling to the dogma that hot girls have to be ‘knocked off their pedastal’ and shown ‘how awesome you are’. Which is so rarely necessary and mostly just serves to make the guy look like a douchebag.

    Guys who are legitimately cool will have no problem whatsoever genuinely complimenting a woman if he feels one is warranted. He also won’t feel the need to demonstrate value through intricate DHV tales…

    As a wise old Zulu man told me while I was living in Africa: “The lion doesn’t have to roar!”

    The lion already has the respect of the jungle, roaring isn’t necessary.

    …so it ought to be with the budding PUA.

    ~Nick Quick (aka Adonis)

  16. @Adonis: Very true, brother. I liken negging and DHVs to communism: Great ideas in theory, but 99% of the time, awful in practice.

    Negging and DHVs being effective are contingent on a) strong social and conversational skills, b) not being weird, c) being very, very subtle, d) having a strong frame/reality, and e) being able to handle contingencies. Unfortunately, if we were that good at all those things, we probably wouldn’t be here in the first place.

    That’s not to say that those concepts are necessarily BAD, they’re just misused way more often than anything else. Think of them as a the flying spin kick of MMA. I’m sure there’s a use for it in SOME circumstance, but that circumstance is SO remote that you’re better off preparing and practicing for the other 99.9% of the time.

  17. It’s part of calibration. Even a guy who has been in the community a year is still trying to figure things out. They go from perceived doormat to ultra asshole, thinking thats the way to be THE MAN.

    WRONG. It just makes you a dick.

    As nearly always, the answer lies somewhere between – experience will help calibrate.

    -Milkman

  18. nice. found you through Kelly Diels’ new post.

  19. Another great post by DJ Fuji – I think once you love a girl it is ok to be yourself. As a matter of fact it is the strong man who is the most vulnerable and in touch with his true emotions.

    Thanks for the link backs to PUA Lingo!
    -AW

  20. Great post I found you through @paulpark new post, glad I check out the link.

    Robx

  21. What post was that?

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